ZeroMq IRC Log

Wednesday April 27, 2011

[Time] Name	Message
[00:09] zedas	ah ok it works but you have to wait a bit for the clients to reconnect
[07:56] pieterh	hi mikko
[07:57] guido_g	good morning Ã¸mq
[08:00] pieterh	hi guido_g!
[08:00] guido_g	good morning pieterh
[08:15] mikko	pieterh: hi
[08:15] pieterh	hi mikko!
[08:15] pieterh	you asked if people were arriving on the 9th
[08:15] pieterh	some are, yes
[08:15] mikko	pieterh: i'll book tickets 9th May - 10t Mayh
[08:16] pieterh	cool!
[08:16] mikko	coming back from holidays today
[08:16] pieterh	I think it's sane to hold a meetup on the evening of the 9th
[08:16] mikko	can i stay at yours?
[08:16] mikko	or should i book a hotel?
[08:16] pieterh	for sure
[08:16] pieterh	stay with us, mato will also be here
[08:16] mikko	thanks
[08:17] pieterh	lots of space, maybe bring a sleeping bag if you have one
[08:17] mikko	i can buy one, it probably has use later
[08:17] mikko	i gotta run, check out soon
[08:17] pieterh	nah, don't waste money for that
[08:17] pieterh	cyl
[08:17] mikko	ill be back around GMT 22:00
[08:17] pieterh	:)
[08:17] pieterh	I'll be drumming
[08:20] guido_g	pieterh: you're writing an app? like app in "app for a phone"?
[08:20] pieterh	hmm, yes
[08:20] guido_g	just saw that tweet of yours
[08:20] guido_g	ahh i see
[08:20] pieterh	its a prototype for a new mobile concept
[08:20] pieterh	has nothing to do with zeromq sadly
[08:21] guido_g	hehe
[08:21] pieterh	except perhaps to convince me we need an HTTP bridge sooner rather than later
[08:21] guido_g	or real operating systems for mobile devices
[08:22] pieterh	as compared to Linux? :)
[08:22] guido_g	no, of course not
[08:23] pieterh	The problem isn't really running the 0MQ stack on Android or iOS
[08:23] guido_g	but this tiny things like s60 or ios will not last any longer
[08:23] pieterh	for sure
[08:23] guido_g	as ia said, real oses
[08:23] guido_g	omg
[08:23] pieterh	there is only one real os, eventually
[08:23] guido_g	let me type this again: as i said
[08:24] guido_g	at only one open source
[08:24] pieterh	the obvious sometimes takes a long time to happen
[08:24] guido_g	i don't know how close the windows mobile os is to the real windows
[08:25] pieterh	real windows is barely a real OS by modern standards
[08:25] guido_g	sigh
[08:25] guido_g	but we do have a build process for it :)
[08:25] guido_g	we := Ã¸mq
[08:25] pieterh	indeed
[08:25] pieterh	problem isn't building 0MQ on random mobile device
[08:26] pieterh	they're all real computers with what approaches an OS
[08:26] Guthur	windows 8 will probably be that 'real OS' on a mobile
[08:26] pieterh	problem is running unsecured protocols over the Internet
[08:26] Guthur	it will have support for the ARM arch
[08:26] guido_g	Guthur: so there two then, and one if them is free and (nearly) open source :)
[08:27] Guthur	guido_g: Android?
[08:27] guido_g	Guthur: jepp
[08:27] guido_g	i consider my beloved maemo dead
[08:27] Guthur	Google got slapped with a fine recently in Texas, for patent infringement related to the linux kernel
[08:28] guido_g	and meego is a still born
[08:28] Guthur	$5m
[08:28] guido_g	yeah, read about it
[08:29] pieterh	Google are big enough to actually take on the patent system, when they get annoyed enough
[08:29] Guthur	this patent is so bogus, it might actually wake people up to the fact it is very broken
[08:30] pieterh	Guthur: you think if it wasn't a bogus patent, that'd be better somehow? :)
[08:30] Guthur	well...
[08:31] pieterh	Imagine some firm comes up with a really valid patent for 'sockets that automatically fan in and fan out'
[08:31] pieterh	filed in 1999 or somesuch
[08:31] Guthur	did you file it, hehe
[08:31] pieterh	sold to some random holding firm... never turned into software...
[08:31] pieterh	no, I'm pointing out that it's not about good vs. bogus patents
[08:32] guido_g	like software and idea patents
[08:32] Guthur	hehe yeah I've read on the net that your have been quite vocal in the past against the current system
[08:33] pieterh	if you want a history lesson in all that is bad about patents: http://www.digitalmajority.org/forum/t-27067/how-the-french-turned-exclusive-privilege-into-property
[08:33] pieterh	this is one reason 0MQ is not a conventional commercial closed-source product
[09:09] djc	pieterh: as for http bridge, I have some code that does 0MQ-to-WebSockets
[09:09] pieterh	djc: that's interesting, have you published it?
[09:09] djc	not yet
[09:10] djc	it's written in Python and it contains some idiosyncrasies specific to the content we're sending over 0MQ
[09:10] djc	but I could probably publish it somewhere
[09:10] pieterh	so its not a generic bridge
[09:10] djc	most of it is generic
[09:10] djc	but we're sending binary content over zeromq, so you need something to translate to JSON (at least, that seemed easier than parsing the binary stuff in JS)
[09:11] pieterh	for sure
[09:11] pieterh	what version of websockets?
[09:11] djc	whatever Fx4 and currently stable Chrome support
[09:11] pieterh	ok, the old hixie spec
[09:11] djc	(you need to tweak a flag in Fx4 because this is the not-so-secure version)
[09:12] djc	we're actually using this in production, but of course I'll update it as soon as the browsers implement the new stuff
[09:12] pieterh	there's a topic page on the wiki, it'd be useful to post something about your websockets bridge IMO
[09:12] guido_g	q: isn't websockets just plain tcp after the http upgrade?
[09:12] pieterh	guido_g: hah
[09:12] djc	guido_g: it's not
[09:12] djc	pieterh: where's that at?
[09:13] guido_g	i'm puzzled
[09:13] pieterh	yeah http://www.zeromq.org/topics:0mq-over-http
[09:13] pieterh	guido_g: it does, at the least, framing
[09:13] pieterh	when it went through the ietf mangler it got a lot more complex
[09:14] guido_g	ok
[09:14] guido_g	will look it up later then
[09:14] guido_g	really thought that after the upgrade the os socket be used as a plain tcp socket
[09:15] djc	no
[09:15] djc	messages are delineated by one-byte header and footer
[09:15] djc	so it's a stream of messages, not a stream of bytes
[09:15] djc	which is probably easier to handle in JS and also maps quite well to 0MQ
[09:15] guido_g	i do not dare to ask why :)
[09:19] djc	ugh, the wikidot thing confuses me
[09:20] djc	I made an account and am trying to comment on the 0mq-over-http page, but it keeps saying "or Sign in as Wikidot user", even though I activated my account and signed in
[09:21] guido_g	cookies
[09:21] guido_g	incl. third party ones :(
[09:22] djc	I deleted all cookies on zeromq-containing domains and the same thing still happens
[09:23] guido_g	you've to allow cookies to be set
[09:29] pieterh	djc: ... are you behind some firewall or proxy?
[09:31] djc	nope
[09:31] djc	there, wrote an account-less comment
[09:37] pieterh	djc: what browser are you using?
[09:39] djc	Fx4
[09:42] pieterh	Fx? Firefox?
[09:42] pieterh	so it's doing something (paranoid/silly/too clever) with cookies
[09:53] guido_g	firefox 4 works, just logged in
[11:13] pieterh	sustrik: ping?
[18:53] Dantman	Are there any api docs for jzmq?
[19:34] staylor	is there a way to get a source ip address of a socket in zeromq given it's id? DEALER->ROUTER where router side requests the id of DEALER
[21:10] Guthur	Dantman, there is some example code in the guide
[21:10] Guthur	staylor, not that I am aware of
[21:11] Dantman	I know there is the guide, some example code, and zmq docs... but it's a little awkward to read zmq docs to look at the api and try to translate that to Java
[21:11] Dantman	...especially since I don't do C
[21:54] mikko	good evening
[21:59] mikko	pieterh: eurostar booked
[22:20] staylor	I asked earlier, wondering if anyone knows if it's possible to get the remote ip address of a socket? ie: a router socket getting the ip address of the dealer socket connected to it?
[22:26] mikko	staylor: nope, you have to embed this information into messages if you need it
[22:44] staylor	mikko: yeah encoding it into the message isn't really possible since the dealer could be behind a nat